AHCWI: Spain A Major Power In Africa

[AltoRegnant]

Spain's empire focused heavily on the new world, at the expense of their potential in Asia and Africa. while they still conquered the Philippines, their territory in Africa was truly pathetic. the northern third of morocco; western Sahara, and Equitorial Guinea made up the sum of the Spanish African Empire. Your goal is to make Spain a major power in Africa, with a POD after Colombia becomes independent (1819) to the first carlist war (1833).

By major power, i mean they need at least 10% of Africa, and they need to run as much of a profit as posssible

 

[Silver01]

after america independance ... oh that is hard
the Trienio Liberal is kinda of avoidable now after the victory at Puente de Boyacá and the victories at the south in chile spanish america is dead peru like the olt would hold until 1820s but its gone , spain would have to get a second revival for second spanish empire industralization started late for spain and the dedaces follwing the american indepdance it was getting weaker avoiding the carlist war would help but still you would need a good king to make this possible i cant think of anyhting
post 1819 that would help

 

[Osman Aga]

Spain may get lucky and get the Congo Basin and Gabon in addition to their OTL colonies. Avoid the Civil War of the 1870s and Spain stands much stronger.

 

[AltoRegnant]

after america independance ... oh that is hard
the Trienio Liberal is kinda of avoidable now after the victory at Puente de Boyacá and the victories at the south in chile spanish america is dead peru like the olt would hold until 1820s but its gone , spain would have to get a second revival for second spanish empire industralization started late for spain and the dedaces follwing the american indepdance it was getting weaker avoiding the carlist war would help but still you would need a good king to make this possible i cant think of anyhting
post 1819 that would help

maybe they see British investment in order to have a better counter-balance to France or Italy? in this context we could see London backing the Spanish in Africa as a secondary power

 

[Silver01]

maybe they see British investment in order to have a better counter-balance to France or Italy? in this context we could see London backing the Spanish in Africa as a secondary power

Propping up the Spanish doesn't make thar much sense the french algeria was not treat and since you mentioned Italy that would mean italian unification
Which would be the same time as German unification
By that the British worry would be germany unless germany and spain both had eyes for kamerun

 

[AltoRegnant]

could a stablized spain push for a Kongolese colony and get it in Leopold's place?

 

[Aghasverov]

IIRC Spain, at the Berlin Conference, tried to claim a great deal more of Equatorial Africa than the postage-stamp area of Rio Muni that they wound up with, but the German and French contingents were in no mood to grant them anything but the de minimus interpretation of their claims...

 

[Pauh the federalist]

Most of the land won't be profitable but you could have Spain push for the borders of greater Morocco (red dotted line) which should give it a respectable chunk of northern africa close to its mainland and coupled with a possibly expanded Spanish congo that helps us closer to the 10% of Africa minumum requirement but I think we might still be falling a little short of the requirement. Anyone else have any plausible ideas that might be worth exploring?

 

[Al-numbers]

One interesting way of having a larger Spanish presence would be to make the Great Powers stymied over dividing Africa and having Spain be a neutral compromise. Bonus points if Leopold II gets killed or dies before 1885.

That is what I did for my Rajahs and Hornbills timelime, with Spain getting (most of) the Congo basin as a result of Leopold's earlier death and a need for the Great Powers to not let their rivals be too powerful. However, Spain's 'bequeathment' also came with a caveat: open the basin to free trade in exploiting the region.

To make things more interesting, I also made the Great Powers nab much of the Congo basin's borderlands, too. Compromises only last as long as they're convenient to all parties. 😉

 

[AltoRegnant]

IIRC Spain, at the Berlin Conference, tried to claim a great deal more of Equatorial Africa than the postage-stamp area of Rio Muni that they wound up with, but the German and French contingents were in no mood to grant them anything but the de minimus interpretation of their claims...

Do you know why germany and france were against a powerful spain in africa? I understand germany would be bitter about losing their ally/client state after the failure to put the honzenrollens on the throne, but spain would likely be a decent boon to paris as an ally if it was in a good position in africa. After all, unlike Belgium, Spain would actually be somewhat able to resist if a major power came knocking.

 

[Aghasverov]

Do you know why germany and france were against a powerful spain in africa? I understand germany would be bitter about losing their ally/client state after the failure to put the honzenrollens on the throne, but spain would likely be a decent boon to paris as an ally if it was in a good position in africa. After all, unlike Belgium, Spain would actually be somewhat able to resist if a major power came knocking.

Well, I would say "greed" but chances are it was a bit more complex than that. Bismarck was a bit skeptical of the worth of colonial ventures in the 1st place, and German interests in Kamerun and French interests in Equatorial Africa were driven mainly by the corporations that controlled the trading and resource exploitation there... i'd say it may have had more to do with the principle of "effective control" - both France and Germany had actively probed into the interior, while Spain, though she had claims in equatorial Africa for centuries, had seldom ventured far away from the coast, and had no lasting presence in the interior...

 

[AltoRegnant]

Well, I would say "greed" but chances are it was a bit more complex than that. Bismarck was a bit skeptical of the worth of colonial ventures in the 1st place, and German interests in Kamerun and French interests in Equatorial Africa were driven mainly by the corporations that controlled the trading and resource exploitation there... i'd say it may have had more to do with the principle of "effective control" - both France and Germany had actively probed into the interior, while Spain, though she had claims in equatorial Africa for centuries, had seldom ventured far away from the coast, and had no lasting presence in the interior...

so it was spain's historical ambivalence to Africa that led to it not being allowed a major portion? That doesn't really make sense given that the other powers had only begun turning their eyes to it after Napoleon's defeat.