Bicentennial Man: Ford '76 and Beyond

Hmm. Let's see. Iraq borders Turkey, Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and Iran.
Turkey *unlikely*, Syria *could be interesting*, Jordan *no idea*, Saudi Arabia *the US sends troops*, Kuwait *same question as OTL*, can we get troops there in time....
I don’t think, though I know very little of the early 1980s dynamics there, that Kuwait had pissed Saddam off yet with its flooding the markets with oil to kneecap his efforts against Iran or engaged in slant drilling.
Gotta love how this TL found new and exciting ways to create a dystopia in LatAm. It is horryfing but at least it is original
Haha thank you! we haven’t even gotten to the Shiny Bois really starting to take off…
*Insert obligatory question about how's Panama doing after Ford's invasion*
I'm kinda interested in how they're dealing in the immediate aftermath of it, because there is no absolutely no way in hell it goes anywhere near as well as Just Cause did for the US (the Panamanian population will be FAR more hostile to US occupation forces than they were IOTL). Plus there's the question of the fate of the canal and whether an alt-Torrijos-Carter treaty happens (I'd guess not, but we shall see), and it'd be interesting seeing how it factors into LATAM's general dysfunction (where Ford's intervention likely makes it one of the more notable basket cases in a region already full of them).
There’s actually a Panama-centric update on docket for the end of 1981 drawn from your feedback, funny enough!
Which i imagine will cause a even bigger surge of immigration from LatAm in the 1980s
Mmhmm
Besides South America, I would love to know what's happening in Italy ITTL
We know Aldo Moro wasn't kidnapped so the Historical Compromise was successful
However we also know the war in Sweden damaged the popularity of Eurocomunism.

So either Italy is somehow going to be the exception to the more conservative 90s, or a new rightwing political party is going to emerge.

I wonder if Mani Pulite is going to happen ITTL (the corruption system started well before Craxi), and how it could impact Italy if the PCI is still around
I left the Aldo Moro incident as-is, though I haven’t decided quite what to do with Mani Pulite yet. As for now, a more successful Spadolini is what I have ahead for the 80s
Privately held by (Canadian) Irving Gould who did not want to give up on it. As for Acorn they had to be bailed out in 1985 by Olivetti (an Italian computer maker), they really were small.

Maybe Olivetti has big dreams? Because they have the hardware, they’re in Europe with the dealer network, they picked up Acorn… all they really need is say the Amiga team to do software and collaborate with Acorn on hardware.

(Edit: it wouldn’t be *that* hard to have computing industry national champion software platforms for fun: maybe Apple/Sony for Japan, Amiga/Acorn/Olivetti Europe, IBM/Atari USA kinda thing.)
I like that idea. Question is how you get Amiga out of Gould’s hands
 
As for now, a more successful Spadolini is what I have ahead for the 80s
Honestly I am just surprised you know about his existence and his government.

Interesting with him in charge, Mani Pulite could be less devastating for the Italian political world. OTL Craxi's attempted cover-up significantly damaged both the DC and PSI's popularity to the point they both collapse.

If the scandal happens and Spadolini, quite literally one of the few political figures not involved in the scandal IRL, is more honest about it, the PSI and DC could survive ITTL

Of course, it could also significantly increase the PRI's popularity.

In any case, no Berlusconi. It is a big win.
 
Honestly I am just surprised you know about his existence and his government.

Interesting with him in charge, Mani Pulite could be less devastating for the Italian political world. OTL Craxi's attempted cover-up significantly damaged both the DC and PSI's popularity to the point they both collapse.

If the scandal happens and Spadolini, quite literally one of the few political figures not involved in the scandal IRL, is more honest about it, the PSI and DC could survive ITTL

Of course, it could also significantly increase the PRI's popularity.

In any case, no Berlusconi. It is a big win.
Only uncovered him in my research into Propaganda Due for this TL, but the idea of him having some longevity in the 1980s/more successful PRI i need to give credit to @The Ghost of Danton as it was he who suggested it to me
 
, start to collaborate more thoroughly with communist-sympathetic clerics,
Sanjabi: You guys, remember that thing that really hurt Mossadegh? Let't do that! (though Mossadegh went for the communist party itself, so not completely the same)
[3] It's really remarkable how similar 1979 in Iran was, with both Bazargan and Bakhtiar thinking they could work with Khomeini initially, to Russia in 1917 and Kerensky, Guchkov, etc assuming the same of Lenin
To be fair to them, Khomeini ran a masterfull propaganda campaign. Seriously, he convinced everyone he needed to that he had absolutely no interest in real power. The government didn't help itself by banning his earlier texts that clearly stated his Clerical dictatorship plans.
 
Sanjabi: You guys, remember that thing that really hurt Mossadegh? Let't do that! (though Mossadegh went for the communist party itself, so not completely the same)

To be fair to them, Khomeini ran a masterfull propaganda campaign. Seriously, he convinced everyone he needed to that he had absolutely no interest in real power. The government didn't help itself by banning his earlier texts that clearly stated his Clerical dictatorship plans.
My read on Sanjabi, which granted isn’t super thorough, is that he was not a very sharp guy. Bakhtiar and Bazargan can credibly be said to have been screwed by circumstances (especially the former) that rapidly left their control.

And, yes, he absolutely was one of the more cunning operators of his day. One ponders if he had croaked a few years earlier how much more the mullahs may have been influenced by the thinking of those such as Shariatmadari
 
There’s actually a Panama-centric update on docket for the end of 1981 drawn from your feedback, funny enough!
I am very excitement. Also, Poppy was still there, though as SecState this time, so interesting to see how he dealt with the very different situation ITTL from Just Cause IOTL.
If you have any trouble with the particularities I'd be happy to help!
Sanjabi: You guys, remember that thing that really hurt Mossadegh? Let't do that! (though Mossadegh went for the communist party itself, so not completely the same)
US: DO WE NEED A LITTLE FREEDOM AGAIN, GUYS?
Though I imagine Carey is going to be infinitely more chill about this than Ike ever was.
 
I like that idea. Question is how you get Amiga out of Gould’s hands
You’re thinking of Commodore Amiga I presume. That’s a story!

The Amiga project started as a video game console funded by dude who got rich via Activision. Then Commodore crashed the market, fired their CEO, said CEO bought Atari for revenge and because what else was he going to do?

At the time the Amiga project pivoted to computing because of the crash, Steve Jobs kicked the tires and told them “too many chips”, and so Amiga was desperate for cash. Warner/Atari provided the bridge loan on the condition that if Amiga couldn’t pay it back they owned Amiga.

Desperate not to be bought by ex-Commodore CEO Amiga found new funding with… Commodore! Snatching the next gen platform from their former CEO’s hands!

So anyway yeah Amiga can be bought by anyone with a few million, as long as they have another hundred million to throw at finishing it and marketing.
 
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I am very excitement. Also, Poppy was still there, though as SecState this time, so interesting to see how he dealt with the very different situation ITTL from Just Cause IOTL.
If you have any trouble with the particularities I'd be happy to help!

US: DO WE NEED A LITTLE FREEDOM AGAIN, GUYS?
Though I imagine Carey is going to be infinitely more chill about this than Ike ever was.
Though Baby Shah is a little more reasonable/responsive to public grievances than his late Dad was, it’s still the US-favoring regime in place in Tehran, and Carey was no Carter (as having Jackson as SecDef would suggest), so that’s good enough for him
You’re thinking of Commodore Amiga I presume. That’s a story!

The Amiga project started as a video game console funded by dude who got rich via Activision. Then Commodore crashed the market, fired their CEO, said CEO bought Atari for revenge and because what else was he going to do?

At the time the Amiga project pivoted to computing because of the crash, Steve Jobs kicked the tires and told them “too many chips”, and so Amiga was desperate for cash. Warner/Atari provided the bridge loan on the condition that if Amiga couldn’t pay it back they owned Amiga.

Desperate not to be bought by ex-Commodore CEO Amiga found new funding with… Commodore! Snatching the next gen platform from their former CEO’s hands!

So anyway yeah Amiga can be bought by anyone with a few million, as long as they have another hundred million to throw at finishing it and marketing.
Would Olivetti/Acorn have such funds, I wonder?
 
I've been reading this for a long time as a lurker and I have to say I'm hooked! I'm interested to see what is in the works with Saudi Arabia seeing as the Iranian revolution has been avoided.
 
A Tale of Two Chinas - Part I
A Tale of Two Chinas - Part I

The early 1980s is often marked as a point at which the Republic of China, bunkered away on the island of Taiwan, and the People's Republic of China in the Mainland, started to see broader and broader divergences. Buffeted by a series of labor reforms in the mid-1970s, Taiwan's economic growth began to seriously outpace that of the PRC, helped in large part not only by cheap consumer goods and electronics manufacturing but by increasingly sophisticated logistics and microchip operations, and the authoritarian shell both had sat under since 1949 began to crack east of the Taiwan Straits while in Beijing things were as top-down as ever.

Indeed, in the views of many senior Chinese officials, they probably had to be. The autumn of 1981 brought with it two major challenges that badly strained the Hua Guofeng regime's authority both with the CCP luminaries who surrounded him (known collectively as the "Seven Elders," many of whom were not particularly strong supporters of his) and the Chinese street. The first was the much-awaited trial of the Gang of Four, the group of ultra-Maoist ideologues who had steered much of public discourse during the late Cultural Revolution and sought to run China upon Mao's death, including the late Chairman's wife, Jiang Qing and a genuinely dangerous and ambitious young demagogue in Wang Hongwen. Part of the reason the Gang of Four had fallen from power and grace in 1976 was that, to put it simply, most people with power within the CCP genuinely despised them, as did the military, which by the late 1970s had formed something of its own power base. Hua, who had very powerful allies within the intelligence services on whom he relied to prop up his power within China, had been the leading figure in their arrest and charges of treason.

The actual trial of the Gang of Four, however, split opinion on Hua within the party. Elders such as Yang Shangkun and Peng Yen, who had been allies of the late Deng Xiaopeng and thus had never warmed to Hua to begin with, took the stance that Hua's chosen prosecutors were incompetent, and assumed that it was Hua who had deliberately done so. Setting aside for a fact that in a system such as the PRC's the guilt of the Gang of Four was fairly plainly pre-determined, the trial of the Gang of Four - how it was reported on, what prosecutors discussed before the judge, how party members reacted - became part of a power struggle within the Politburo between Hua's enemies, the military, and the intelligence services. In the end, of course, the Gang of Four were all sentenced; Jiang, the infamous and colorful "Madame Mao" regarded as the most rabid enthusiast of the Cultural Revolution's excesses, defended herself and stood defiant, while Wang and Yao Wenyuan expressed repentance for not only their crimes but, perhaps more gravely in Red China, their "political errors." On December 1st, 1981, they were given sentences of twenty years apiece, which Hua's detractors took as evidence of his being too light. [1] Hua, who had always been careful not to fully repudiate and reject the Cultural Revolution even as it was clearly time for China to move on, made an address flanked by his chief allies Wang Dongxing, Wu De, Ji Dengkui and Chen Xilian - now derisively called the "Little Gang of Four" - to declare "justice has been served against the political errancy of these four traitors to China and the memory of Chairman Mao" and suggested, "It is the hour to turn a new leaf." The "New Leaf Policy" became understood to not just mean China moving on from the Four with their sentences but the Cultural Revolution generally, mostly by pretending that it didn't happen, so that its diminishing but still-influential supporters could still tell themselves that it had been the proper implementation of Mao Zedong Thought against the bourgeois and feudal history of China that needed to be purified, and its detractors could persuade themselves that nothing like that would ever happen again. [2] Indeed, the New Leaf Policy could have buffeted Hua tremendously, had he himself not been enamored with Mao's legacy and had the Chinese famine of 1981-82 not struck at approximately the same time.

The early 1980s famine was nowhere near as severe as infamous famines such as 1907 or 1928-30, to say nothing of the Great Chinese Famine of twenty years prior that was associated with Mao's mishandling of the Great Leap Forward, but it nonetheless was a major challenge for the government and estimates range from between four to five million Chinese, primarily children and the elderly, starving to death between the harvest of 1981 and late spring of the following year. While Western media access to China was always haphazard, photographs and footage showed emaciated youths and conditions in some parts of the Chinese countryside that looked more similar to parts of Sub-Saharan Africa than the confident People's Republic that was presenting itself to the world after Mao's death and Nixon's visit a decade earlier. It also was a very dark and grim reminder of the Great Leap Forward at precisely a time when Mao's legacy was being interrogated within the CCP's upper echelons (his legacy was to say the least not up for debate within its middle and lower levels of internal organs) and it was an open question of whether his mistakes should be recognized publicly and rejected a la Khrushchev's policy on Stalinism. The trial and famine together thus served to present the Chinese people and leadership, simultaneously, with potent reminders of the two largest blemishes on Mao's record, blemishes which for most Chinese over the age of thirty were within recent and living memory.

With Deng's death, Hua's rise and the advanced age of many of the Elders, however, finding a suitable power base opposed to Hua was difficult and had to come from outside of the circle around Yang and Peng. The famine, ironically enough, provided just such a figure - from Sichuan province, where most people would have asked "what famine?" thanks to the efforts of the experimental agricultural management practices of local functionary Zhao Ziyang, [3] who had been rehabilitated after the Cultural Revolution and had been regarded as having reached the limits of what he could achieve once his sympathizer Deng had passed. Sichuan's weathering of the famine and strong economic growth, especially compared with larger and wealthier provinces in the east, caught people's attention, however, and with that Zhao was invited back to Beijing to be within the Central Committee and help manage the end of the famine response, even if Hua didn't entirely trust the reasons for his enemies in the Politburo wanting the talented young reformer promoted higher...

[1] This is similar, though not exactly, to how the Gang of Four trial played out IOTL, where Deng's consolidated power and his broader support from the other Elders gave him much broader leeway.
[2] Suffice to say this is not how you generally solve problems
[3] Those familiar with Chinese history know why this name is important and why he's not going to click with Hua long-term, to say the least
 
I've been reading this for a long time as a lurker and I have to say I'm hooked! I'm interested to see what is in the works with Saudi Arabia seeing as the Iranian revolution has been avoided.
Thank you!

I haven’t entirely worked out all the Saudi details but it’s not going to be good.

Is Robert S. Strauss the current ambassador to the soviet union?
That was a position he didn’t fill until the 1990s IOTL so idk where Carey would slot him. He’d certainly be somewhere in the admin, though.
Zhao is going to be TTL’s Gorbachev, isn’t it?
Lol was the throwaway line about agricultural policy reform the tell? 😜
 
Lol was the throwaway line about agricultural policy reform the tell?
His stance during Tiananmen, the desire to achieve freedom of speech tell me enough about what kind of man he is.
Hopefully, he's a Gorbachev without a Yeltsin. Definitely don't need a China that follows that trajectory.
Well, after putting some thought, here is an quick analog list I made:
1985-1991 Zhao Ziyang
1991-2000 Jiang Zeming
2000-2008 Wang Huning
2008-2016 Wang Yi
2016-XXXX Wang Huning
 
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Hopefully, he's a Gorbachev without a Yeltsin. Definitely don't need a China that follows that trajectory.
My thinking is that the dynamic with Taiwan and potential reunification prevents a full 90s Russia scenario, though that also opens the question of how Taiwan’s political class - at that time no longer dominated by the “thousand year” men but still largely comprised of mainland-born KMT conservatives - would integrate itself into a reunified China. That’s an interesting and probably hugely cursed thing to consider…
His stance during Tiananmen, the desire to achieve freedom of speech tell me enough about what kind of man he is.

Well, after putting some thought, here is an quick analog list I made:
1985-1991 Zhao Ziyang
1991-2000 Jiang Zeming
2000-2008 Wang Huning
2008-2016 Wang Yi
2016-XXXX Wang Huning
I see what you’re doing here, and Wang Huning as China’s Putin makes obvious sense, but Jiang Zemin is way too competent/insufficiently blackout drunk to serve as an alt-Yeltsin haha
 
at that time no longer dominated by the “thousand year” men but still largely comprised of mainland-born KMT conservatives - would integrate itself into a reunified China. That’s an interesting and probably hugely cursed thing to consider…
Well you better not let Lee-Tung Hui become the president of China if you went for reunification route, every time I see that happened in any alternate history made me want to smash my head with a rock.
 
I see what you’re doing here, and Wang Huning as China’s Putin makes obvious sense, but Jiang Zemin is way too competent/insufficiently blackout drunk to serve as an alt-Yeltsin haha
To be fair I can’t recall any drunkard get elected to high office in East Asia, that would only be seen as unprofessional in here.
 
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Well you better not let Lee-Tung Hui become the president of China if you went for reunification route, every time I see that happened in any alternate history made me want to smash my head with a rock.
I’m with you on that. I very strongly doubt that a Palace Faction that has just realized their wildest dreams is letting him anywhere near the reigns of power when they’re trying to reconsolidate a reunified China. They probably wouldn’t even let an anodyne moderate like Lien Chan near the big seat. A Lee Huan/Hau Pei-tsun style old-timer, on the other hand…
To be fair I can’t recall any drunkard get elected to high office in East Asia, that would only be seen as unprofessional in here.
Fair enough!
 
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