Ramontxo
Donor
Not that good using AP but having the 37 mm Browning firing clip feeded HE shells? Once lend lease is on and using them in the armoured cars...Easier to rechamber the OQF 2Pdr to take the Bofors round.
Not that good using AP but having the 37 mm Browning firing clip feeded HE shells? Once lend lease is on and using them in the armoured cars...Easier to rechamber the OQF 2Pdr to take the Bofors round.
Probably because Britain is still in the deter war phase rather than the fight war stage in the Far East. Nelson is still a vary powerful ship and beyond the Yamato's Japan won't have anything that can go one on one with her.In terms of Force Z, I do have to wonder why include the HMS Nelson, because at 23 knots top speed, it's going to be a real drag on the formation.
I guess the formation will probably deploy in multiple parts. Nelson and Barham will deploy as a slow battlesquadron while POW and Repulse will deploy as a slow battle squadron.In terms of Force Z, I do have to wonder why include the HMS Nelson, because at 23 knots top speed, it's going to be a real drag on the formation.
Shouldn't that be "while POW and Repulse will deploy as a fast battle squadron"?I guess the formation will probably deploy in multiple parts. Nelson and Barham will deploy as a slow battlesquadron while POW and Repulse will deploy as a slow battle squadron.
yep you are correct. mistype.Shouldn't that be "while POW and Repulse will deploy as a fast battle squadron"?
There's no available evidence for an Australian based fuzed shell. What was used was a nose fuzed shell taken from the naval 40mm Pom Pom put into the 2pdr ATG gun case, more or less one of the solutions the British also arrived at. Every time there is mention of a 2pdr HE in use by Australia, where specific details are noted, it is always either that one or very rarely the original APHE.2 pounder HE rounds were not in production until 1942 with 40,000 rounds produced that year and I believe that the Australians produced a base fused variant as you say designed to defeat the excellent Japanese bunkers
A comment on the Force Z composition: I think our guide should be OTL plans and how the Mediterranean Theater is changed.
As mentioned by the author, HMS Illustrious and HMS Formitable are not badly damaged. Moreover, Britain had retained Cyrenaica so there is no reason at all for Club Runs. That means that HMS Ark Royal and HMS Nelson are not damaged as well. Having retained Cyrenaica and Crete, the British can send supplies to Malta from Alexandria since they can provide air cover for the convoys for the vast majority of the way. That fundamentally changes to role of Force H. It won't be needed as a strike force, capable of forcing its way close to the italian bases of Sardinia and Sicily. Its new role is that of protecting convoys in the Atlantic.
For this new role, Force H doesn't need fast battleships or the most capable carriers. HMS Eagle or HMS Furious and R-class battleships (or perhaps HMS Barham) will suffice. Last but not least, Somerville is too senior and experienced to lead a formation that is now (since spring 1941) of reduced importance. Likewise, after the sinking of the Bismarck, HMS Rodney won't be needed in Force H. That means that her crew will be ready and available in Q4 1941, while the ship would have had time in the yard.
When it comes to carriers, the Ark Royal was designed with a mind of operating at the Indo-Pacific, that I would guess that she will be a choice carrier.
At the minimum, I expect a Force Z consisting of: 2 Nelson-class BB, 1 CV, 1 BC and a few additional cruisers and destroyers (no huge losses at Crete).
Considering the more favourable conditions in the Mediterranean, it is quite possible that HMS Prince of Wales and an armoured carrier are added as well.
Since this Force Z will have more and more powerful ships than Force H, it seems to me that Somerville is the natural commander for it.
The last thing on the agenda was where and when the Canadians would cut their teeth. The fighting in Libya was reaching its conclusion, so the Middle East was less of a possibility than previously. War warnings in the Far East were increasing, and the arrival of Canadian troops in Hong Kong mean that Prime Minister King was aware of that threat. The invasion of France to liberate it was something that was beginning to be talked about, but doing so anytime before 1943 at the earliest was as much as anyone could foretell. Until all four Divisions were fully prepared it was somewhat speculative, but McNaughton was confident that his
True, though I'm not sure how much better off they are overall. A lack of resources needed for repair does, however, mean more resources available for construction, so a few more submarines and smaller vessels might be available.Also given the lack of damage it frees both man power and material that would be used to repair them as well. Since carriers use a lot of steel and other equipment when it comes to repairing the battle damage it also means hey freed up capacity means other overhauls and productions can be taken place as well which means the RN will be in a bit better health compared to OTL.
Mm, not enough sealift to do the job, plus there's untis in place that are better acclimatised. I'm getting a feeling of Dieppe here.Hmm maybe they could be redeployed for a possible Invasion of Sicily? I mean it could be a good place for a Canadian Formation to cut their teeth as well as give them needed battle experience. Failing that maybe move then to Tripoli? I mean we still don't know which way French North Africa will jump could be useful having a Canadian formation as a reserve.
Thank you for that. I have been guilty of repeating the internet lore of Australian base fused 2 Pounde HE.There's no available evidence for an Australian based fuzed shell. What was used was a nose fuzed shell taken from the naval 40mm Pom Pom put into the 2pdr ATG gun case, more or less one of the solutions the British also arrived at. Every time there is mention of a 2pdr HE in use by Australia, where specific details are noted, it is always either that one or very rarely the original APHE.
It looks like this, identified as No. 5 in the center, and while it says it is for the carrier it will work out of any 2pdr sans Littlejohn:
My information came from direct correspondence with Mike Cecil, in 2000, he commenced work at the Australian War Memorial in Canberra as an Assistant Curator in the Military Heraldry and Technology Section. Within a year, he was promoted to Curator, and shortly afterwards, to Senior Curator. In 2004, he was appointed Acting Head of Military Heraldry and Technology, with confirmation as Head of Military Heraldry and Technology several months later in Canberra. The base fused round was apparently intended expressly for use from Matilda tanks, where as the 2 Pdr, carrier tank attack was essentially a 2 Pdr AT Gun taken from the infantry gun and mounted directly on the back of a modified universal carrier, so it would than likely inherit it's rounds from the infantry AT Gun.There's no available evidence for an Australian based fuzed shell. What was used was a nose fuzed shell taken from the naval 40mm Pom Pom put into the 2pdr ATG gun case, more or less one of the solutions the British also arrived at. Every time there is mention of a 2pdr HE in use by Australia, where specific details are noted, it is always either that one or very rarely the original APHE.
It looks like this, identified as No. 5 in the center, and while it says it is for the carrier it will work out of any 2pdr sans Littlejohn:
Yep, however as I told you before I asked Mike about what you you've been saying here because it sounded interesting, but he had never heard of a base fuzed 2 pounder high explosive round and said he had never told anyone about such a thing.My information came from direct correspondence with Mike Cecil, in 2000, he commenced work at the Australian War Memorial in Canberra as an Assistant Curator in the Military Heraldry and Technology Section. Within a year, he was promoted to Curator, and shortly afterwards, to Senior Curator. In 2004, he was appointed Acting Head of Military Heraldry and Technology, with confirmation as Head of Military Heraldry and Technology several months later in Canberra. The base fused round was apparently intended expressly for use from Matilda tanks, where as the 2 Pdr, carrier tank attack was essentially a 2 Pdr AT Gun taken from the infantry gun and mounted directly on the back of a modified universal carrier, so it would than likely inherit it's rounds from the infantry AT Gun.
Except until Italy goes neutral or switches sides, the Italians still have a fleet in the Mediterranean which may sortie, and which precautions need to be taken against.A comment on the Force Z composition: I think our guide should be OTL plans and how the Mediterranean Theater is changed.
As mentioned by the author, HMS Illustrious and HMS Formitable are not badly damaged. Moreover, Britain had retained Cyrenaica so there is no reason at all for Club Runs. That means that HMS Ark Royal and HMS Nelson are not damaged as well. Having retained Cyrenaica and Crete, the British can send supplies to Malta from Alexandria since they can provide air cover for the convoys for the vast majority of the way. That fundamentally changes to role of Force H. It won't be needed as a strike force, capable of forcing its way close to the italian bases of Sardinia and Sicily. Its new role is that of protecting convoys in the Atlantic.
For this new role, Force H doesn't need fast battleships or the most capable carriers. HMS Eagle or HMS Furious and R-class battleships (or perhaps HMS Barham) will suffice. Last but not least, Somerville is too senior and experienced to lead a formation that is now (since spring 1941) of reduced importance. Likewise, after the sinking of the Bismarck, HMS Rodney won't be needed in Force H. That means that her crew will be ready and available in Q4 1941, while the ship would have had time in the yard.
When it comes to carriers, the Ark Royal was designed with a mind of operating at the Indo-Pacific, that I would guess that she will be a choice carrier.
At the minimum, I expect a Force Z consisting of: 2 Nelson-class BB, 1 CV, 1 BC and a few additional cruisers and destroyers (no huge losses at Crete).
Considering the more favourable conditions in the Mediterranean, it is quite possible that HMS Prince of Wales and an armoured carrier are added as well.
Since this Force Z will have more and more powerful ships than Force H, it seems to me that Somerville is the natural commander for it.
There's no available evidence for an Australian based fuzed shell. What was used was a nose fuzed shell taken from the naval 40mm Pom Pom put into the 2pdr ATG gun case, more or less one of the solutions the British also arrived at. Every time there is mention of a 2pdr HE in use by Australia, where specific details are noted, it is always either that one or very rarely the original APHE.
It looks like this, identified as No. 5 in the center, and while it says it is for the carrier it will work out of any 2pdr sans Littlejohn:
The Soviet 45mm was a 310mm long case with 57.8mm base with an 760m/s AP roundEvery time I see images like this, I always wonder the "what if" if the British had simply evolved the 3-pounder into 4-pounder using the same case, but further developing the propellant and projectiles, and then using same engineering from 2-pounder gun and carriage.
Indeed!Except until Italy goes neutral or switches sides, the Italians still have a fleet in the Mediterranean which may sortie, and which precautions need to be taken against.
A british army in Russia will be close to ASB. More convoys would require more shipping capacity. So far the timeline was based on armoured warfare and has influenced the Battle of the Atlantic little to none so far. So, Britain has the same shipping as in OTL. Very difficult to see a drastic change in Arctic Convoys.Also, Stalin will be making noises for ever more convoys to Russia via the Arctic - and if Churchill (in one of his mad idea moments, which Brooke is unable to talk him out of, possibly in this case with a long term look on liberating Poland) actually decides to send a division or more to Russia that way, they will definitely require support and supply and more convoys.
Indeed. But they do not require battleships or Illustrious-class carriers. They require escorts.Plus there are the usual German submarines and surface raiders loose in the Atlantic to worry about.
- The floating dock in Alexandria could not service Nelson or KGV-class batttleships. The Mediterranean Fleet could include only Queen Elizabeths or Rs.